Converting UOX3 to a plot-driven small RPG

[Maarc]

This is probably more off-topic than on, so that's why I'm posting it here. For a while now, I've had a few projects on the boiler, and some ideas in mind. One of which is a 3D client, with free floating camera and what not, which I'm starting to work on more and more (it doesn't do anything but show some terrain at the moment, and not fully textured at that).

I'd always had an idea of trying to convert UOX3 and the UO client to something that could recreate the original Ultima 7 / 7 part 2. However, I don't see that as terribly feasible, it's a *big* project (though the systems are similar enough to not be completely impossible).

So I'm thinking more on creating a framework (server definitely, client possibly, though I wish to) which allows for the creation of small RPGs similar in style to Ultima 7, with a single "avatar" and a cooperative party of PCs that can help out the primary character.

First off, I wonder if people think that is even interesting. But my main purpose (I'll go ahead and start it, whether many want it or not ), is to find out what people think is lacking in the current server, to allow people to create these sorts of experiences / ideas.

What is missing? What is different, but needs changing? Can some things be organised differently that may help matters? What would you like to see put in or removed? I'd like to get feedback, especially from the more creative sources (ie those that run shards and what not) to see where my direction should lie. I already have some ideas of my own, but I'd like to see what others see as the possible issues involved.

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

[Xuri]

Have been thinking in the same lanes for quite some time myself actually heh. Creating a "singleplayer" package out of UOX3, complete with storyline and quests etc.

Would possibly have to spawn a new version of the entire world for each new player character made though. Or.. place each new character in a new facet? hm

[giwo]

What better way to breathe new life into the UO genre than to create a quest-driven focus. Personally I'd like to see it be multiple player, much like baldurs gate or dungeon siege, while still very much focused on following a quest through the game.

[Maarc]

That's one possibility, certainly. Do you remember Ultima 6 at all? It was single player (obviously) but you could have up to a party of 8. And one thing that you could do was detach individual party members from the group and take them elsewhere to do other things. In reality, it wasn't all *that* practical (though there was one puzzle where you had to get a key, and only Sherry the mouse could get it, hence the whole purpose of the system I think). But my reasoning is for something similar. One "main" character + other floaters. Absolutely positively key plot lines are only driven by the main character, but others (PCs) could trigger subplots and even main branches. A cooperative solution to a big giant plot

The alternative, of course, is as you say... spawn the whole world again for each PC, so it essentially becomes a single player game, where multiple players can play at once, but they don't interact with each other, as they get their own view of the world.

I think it's a nifty sort of idea, myself. Do you have any thoughts/ideas/suggestions on what needs to go in / get removed, and what needs to be changed?

[Maarc]

OK, I've had a bit of a think on it, and come up with a few ideas that would need to be put in place / worked on / altered, I think. By and large, most of the stuff can be done via JS, but here's some ideas.

• * Don't need a command subsystem at all. It's a single player game, and doesn't have GMs. Though perhaps it would be worth keeping for dungeon master possibilities.
  * Account system is overly functional. Most of the account functionality isn't required.
  * Character creation would be a different kettle of fish. This would be dependent on a custom client, I believe.
  * World files would be subtly different. We'd need a static skeleton world file which gets instantiated with each new game "start". Changes would have to save out to different files.
  * The whole world would have to progress, as compared to now where only neighbouring regions do. This could be done at a slower rate, with the neighbouring areas considered higher priority.
  * Zip package support. We could congregate some DFNs/JS files together into a single self-contained zip that would be loaded/unloaded as needed.
  * A resource manager, to be able to dynamically load/unload resources as needed. We don't need absolutely everything in memory like we do at the moment.
  * No need for HTML output, or if so, a very different sort (game progression logs rather than server stats).
  * JS scriptable spells! Combined with a custom client (to dictate number of spells) would be very powerful. Note that this could be (barring custom client) retrofitted back to the main base.
  * Party/group support would need to be implemented, to organise the main character and his "party".
  * PC Guilds are unnecessary, though NPC ones may still prove useful. The possibility to join an NPC guild could also be useful (plot).
  * Weather needs to be improved/used, big plot driver. Probably combined with a custom client.
  * XGM would be ripped out entirely, as it serves no real purpose.
  * Message boards may not be needed at all, or if so, in a limited circumstance.
  * Server console could be entirely eliminated. In theory, it should never crash and everything would be through a configuration file.... so it'd never need to be accessed.

The world progress could be retrofitted to current UOX as useful, running at say 1/10th the normal speed. It wouldn't be such a speed hit on a single player game, as there'd be less interactions all around, by and large.

Plot would be driven by JS files, with each PC having a script attached at character creation.

Those are just some thoughts and ideas I've had, thinking about it. I'm quite sure other things may be needed as well. Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

[Xuri]

You'd definately not want to remove the command-sub-system until you're done actually creating the game hehe

And one wouldn't necessarily need a custom client for character creation.. could just take care of that through an ingame script that pops up on character creation. Of course it's a bit clumsy, since the player has to create his character TWICE, but.. ;P

JS Scriptable spells: Again, custom client not really needed. That's only if you want to use the existing "framework" (oo a popular word these days hehe) for spells that exists in the client/UOX. If you script the entire magery system and spells from scratch, you have no limits

[giwo]

Well hopefully UOX will be that portable, at least to some extent.

My personal goals are to get these three major subsystems into JS:

1) Commands

2) Magic

3) Skills

And I've received input from both EviL and Maarc to suggest they feel the same way about it

[Xuri]

What about combat? There are already events and functions for combat-related purposes. The only problem is very few of them work heh..

[giwo]

Combat would certainly be low on the list to push out, this for multiple reasons, however the major one being that it's a very memory-intensive and time-intensive part of the code (somewhere UOX spends alot of time in), so to rely on JS which is somewhat slower than being in the source itself, there would be things to consider before making it a JS subsystem.

[punt]

Have you considered starting with a game engine (complete, with sound, networking, scripting, etc). That seems to be what you are working towards (like the current games that are single player, but can host a "server" for others to join in).

For $100 US, one can get the source and development tools for the Torque engine, that is the same one that powers Tribes 2. Works on all three major OS's, and is C++. No publishing fee if the "company" is under 250,000 USD.

Now, it isn't "great" for an open source project, but if you want a commerical quality engine to begin with, and learn and extend, it may be a far faster way to get where you want to go. But yes,it is $100 US (oh, it includes updates as well). It is at http://www.garagegames.com

[Maarc]

Yeah, I've looked around at more complete game engines rather than individual projects. And while it may be faster, timewise, I think there's less potential for learning too.

Integrating sound, networking, scripting and all that sort of stuff into a rendering engine would be a time consuming process, no doubt. And yes, some examples of that do exist (CrystalSpace has that to some degree, as does NeoEngine).

Perhaps it would be something to consider more as a long-term thing, but at the moment, I'm comfortable with the tools and workflow I already have, compared to learning something else from scratch. But yes, it's definitely something to think about.

[che]

thats a neat idea and all but umm the real fascination with uo is the mmorpg part. and well sure as a side project it would be sweet.

guess its the iris client you talk about umm yup its nice once its finished but using it multiplayer and putting the camera in ego will give the whole game a new mp experience.
perhaps it could be added that ego mode can be enforced on some shards. itd change the whole gameplay especially with real line of sight checks.

just a quick thought.

[Maarc]

Well, it wouldn't be intended as a MMORPG. And some people would prefer the smaller intimacy.

Nope, not talking about the Ultima Iris client at all. I've been working off and on on a 3D Map Viewer, which I intend to finish then perhaps turn into a client.

I presume by ego mode you mean first person?